Right, so we just finished reading some Plato in Greek Civ and are now doing other philosophers influenced by Plato and Socrates. It sounds like the Stoics took some beatings back in the day. OH GAG! They have quotes from Cicero on Fate!! And naturally his quotes are way longer than everyone elses. I swear that man and his run-ons, oh the horror. I think this has him beat though... Diogenes Laertius on Ethics: These are apparently our passions as human beings. "[P]ain is an irrational contraction; its forms are pity, grudging, envy, resentment, heavy-heartedness, congestion, sorrow, anguish, confusion. Fear is the expectation of something bad. These [forms] are brought under fear: dread, hesitation, shame, shock, panic, agony. Desire is an irrational striving, and these [forms] are ranged under it: want, hatred, quarrelsomeness, anger, sexual love, wrath, spiritedness. Pleasure is an irrational elation over what seems to be worth choosing; under it are ranged enchantment, mean-spirited satisfaction, enjoyment, rapture." And let us not forget that the three good states of the soul are joy, caution, and wish. Wait wouldn't wish fall under [gasp!] DEsiRe or even maybe pLEAsUre?!?!?!?! OH NO! Ok, so maybe pain and fear aren't so off the wall but what if, say I'm enjoying my breakfast that's supposed to be a sign saying that I'm succumbing to my desire or pleasure and am not virtuous??? What?!?! It's French Toast!! I think good 'ole Laerty spent to much time thinking and not enough time living. :P